If you want to see what is involved in preserving old particle physics
data, read the story of how JADE data from the 1980s was re-analysed in
the 2000s thanks to incredible efforts by a few collaboration members.
https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__link.springer.com_article_10.1140_epjh_s13129-2D022-2D00047-2D8&d=DwICaQ&c=gRgGjJ3BkIsb5y6s49QqsA&r=gd8BzeSQcySVxr0gDWSEbN-P-pgDXkdyCtaMqdCgPPdW1cyL5RIpaIYrCn8C5x2A&m=IJVw5OIiG01FIuxjjKcB_GyLlKhvuX90s8YJSsTEr9ca9o40pWm_FkEOTzQZs2--&s=_AiIVOkjHoA93uPoKhwpdlesDaN771GrfFyNuAviQsc&e=
https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__www.mpp.mpg.de_en_research_data-2Dpreservation_jade&d=DwICaQ&c=gRgGjJ3BkIsb5y6s49QqsA&r=gd8BzeSQcySVxr0gDWSEbN-P-pgDXkdyCtaMqdCgPPdW1cyL5RIpaIYrCn8C5x2A&m=IJVw5OIiG01FIuxjjKcB_GyLlKhvuX90s8YJSsTEr9ca9o40pWm_FkEOTzQZs2--&s=XRUWasVEN5VuhnCtVGEJIV8oL-YN98J8rk-_HM9HbQ8&e=
Alex
On 10/01/2023 19:49, Keith Lofstrom wrote:
>> From: Konstantin Olchanski <[log in to unmask]>
>> Subject: Re: SL6 ssh fail
> ...
>> It looks like my remaining option is to build openssh from OpenBSD "portable" sources.
> ...
>> - "so old" - like a grand-father's axe, most our SL6 machines hardware was upgraded 2-3 times by now, they run from SSDs on DDR3/DDR4 RAM machines.
>> - exception is VME processors
> I'm on Konstantin's side here - although it is a side many
> light-years wide, with MANY of us spread thinly across it.
>
> While I do not have my grandfather's axe, I still use my
> great-grandfather's carpentry toolbox, which my grandfather
> brought from Sweden in 1911 (I also have my grandfather's
> steamship ticket, and his Swedish-to-English dictionary).
>
> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__eur02.safelinks.protection.outlook.com_-3Furl-3Dhttps-253A-252F-252Furldefense.proofpoint.com-252Fv2-252Furl-253Fu-253Dhttp-2D3A-5F-5Fwiki.keithl.com-5FJohanSigfridLofstrom-2526d-253DDwIBAg-2526c-253DgRgGjJ3BkIsb5y6s49QqsA-2526r-253Dgd8BzeSQcySVxr0gDWSEbN-2DP-2DpgDXkdyCtaMqdCgPPdW1cyL5RIpaIYrCn8C5x2A-2526m-253DiqT8zmlP56N56Jq9YP-5Fa6cjE90PVa3LlHNdlKR14LBh4UY7CFKqQzSC6tQwZud2d-2526s-253D-5FbHbAaGb3b436-2DGEoRYnWCwPRLp6V7b-5FtiSALqhmBzY-2526e-253D-26data-3D05-257C01-257Cfincha-2540live.lancs.ac.uk-257Cf9e8f61e32044bf0af9a08daf3449569-257C9c9bcd11977a4e9ca9a0bc734090164a-257C0-257C0-257C638089773137567708-257CUnknown-257CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0-253D-257C3000-257C-257C-257C-26sdata-3DLM0VUaRN5QZVD-252FkJ8rIyrE-252F-252FXK8BCBONrMx4DM6n-252BOY-253D-26reserved-3D0&d=DwICaQ&c=gRgGjJ3BkIsb5y6s49QqsA&r=gd8BzeSQcySVxr0gDWSEbN-P-pgDXkdyCtaMqdCgPPdW1cyL5RIpaIYrCn8C5x2A&m=IJVw5OIiG01FIuxjjKcB_GyLlKhvuX90s8YJSsTEr9ca9o40pWm_FkEOTzQZs2--&s=-ekk06zgRkwYDqOinEGNEjW8st5aRlsUt6TaHT_efME&e=
>
> I use those tools to build the gizmos that help me imagine
> space technology evolution into the 22nd century (and read
> emails from my Swedish fourth-cousins).
>
> Science has plucked almost all of the low-hanging fruit;
> future discovery lies in subtle manipulations of vast
> amounts of both new and archived measurements made by
> vast amounts of hardware accumulated over many decades.
>
> The huge problem with archived measurements is their origin
> in imperfect and evolving hardware, software, procedures,
> theories, and people. Those inputs color the data; new
> data collected with new hardware, software, etc. can be
> incommensurate with old data. This is a good reason for
> keeping the old hardware/software sets alive, so you can
> measure twice, with your great-grandfather's ruler and
> with your laser interferometer, and cross-calibrate the
> data taken both ways.
>
> Konstantin contributes to TRIUMF, Canada's premiere
> particle accelerator. I am amused that the photo associated
> with the TRIUMF Wikipedia page shows a Tektronix oscilloscope
> designed in the 1960s:
>
> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__eur02.safelinks.protection.outlook.com_-3Furl-3Dhttps-253A-252F-252Furldefense.proofpoint.com-252Fv2-252Furl-253Fu-253Dhttp-2D3A-5F-5Fen.wikipedia.org-5Fwiki-5FTRIUMF-2D23-5Fmedia-5FFile-2D3ACanadian-2D5FScience-2D5F-2D2D-2D5FTRIUMF-2D5Fcyclotron-2D5F-2D2D-2D5FFlickr-2D5F-2D2D-2D5FCargo-2D5FCult-2D5F-2D2821-2D29.jpg-2526d-253DDwIBAg-2526c-253DgRgGjJ3BkIsb5y6s49QqsA-2526r-253Dgd8BzeSQcySVxr0gDWSEbN-2DP-2DpgDXkdyCtaMqdCgPPdW1cyL5RIpaIYrCn8C5x2A-2526m-253DiqT8zmlP56N56Jq9YP-5Fa6cjE90PVa3LlHNdlKR14LBh4UY7CFKqQzSC6tQwZud2d-2526s-253DVoPCz-5FdAeUSdH6dEptF53yurEpghrR-2DJZvyRjGJ0Sj0-2526e-253D-26data-3D05-257C01-257Cfincha-2540live.lancs.ac.uk-257Cf9e8f61e32044bf0af9a08daf3449569-257C9c9bcd11977a4e9ca9a0bc734090164a-257C0-257C0-257C638089773137567708-257CUnknown-257CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0-253D-257C3000-257C-257C-257C-26sdata-3DiCg8AGbKud1aTD5W-252FBA2x-252Ba3UvY6lPAN9fPASBxX8I4-253D-26reserved-3D0&d=DwICaQ&c=gRgGjJ3BkIsb5y6s49QqsA&r=gd8BzeSQcySVxr0gDWSEbN-P-pgDXkdyCtaMqdCgPPdW1cyL5RIpaIYrCn8C5x2A&m=IJVw5OIiG01FIuxjjKcB_GyLlKhvuX90s8YJSsTEr9ca9o40pWm_FkEOTzQZs2--&s=iG753yvG6UG1NkdZOdgI42JK-GBTHivNURXzvfkaxbY&e=
>
> Also a large pipe and a huge dewar labeled "HELIUM", which
> will probably be all used up and dissipated to outer space
> by 2160. Data measured with instruments consuming large
> amounts of helium may be non-repeatable in 2160.
> Yet somehow, data wranglers like Konstantin must "pay data
> forward" so that 2160 scientists can evaluate 2023 data
> (and 1968 data, TRIUMF's founding) in an accurate context.
>
> ----
>
> I began using Scientific Linux because I assumed that
> Fermilabs would maintain its data-handling infrastructure
> for decades. I believed the RedHat booth-boys at Oscon
> who told me that long term support would not be affected
> by the sale to IBM.
>
> Oops.
>
> With decades of investment in my Gnome2-based creations,
> I spent the last year flirting with Ubuntu-Mate - and
> last week fault-isolating a borked desktop environment
> (log error: Could not acquire name on session bus)
> to a flaw in /etc/X11/Xsession.d/80mate-environment,
> cured(?) by adding "unset DBUS_SESSION_BUS_ADDRESS"
> before the closing "fi" in that file.
>
> So, after climbing out of the Scientific Linux rubble,
> then beating my head against the crumbling Ubuntu wall,
> my next desperate move is to debian-mate, hoping that
> some flavor of mate (or other "gestureless" desktop)
> will last until I (and my jittery hands) die.
> The only gesture I'm good at involves my middle finger.
>
> I hope that the data and algorithms that I create in the
> debian-mate environment will endure, even if the desktop
> environment creators transition from mouse gestures to
> hand gestures to rectal thermometer squeezes.
>
> I'm a circuit designer, more adept with solder than shell
> scripts. My guess is that Konstantin is closer to me on
> the hardware-software spectrum than he is to most of you;
> he must make the instruments attached to Canada's premiere
> particle accelerator produce reliable and secure data, not
> animated web pages. TRIUMF's data must be accessible and
> verifiable a century from now, so future researchers can
> answer the perpetual question about the past:
>
> "What the HELL were they THINKING?"
>
> Blovation off: Now I must go outside with my great-
> grandfather's tools, to repair a 1960s greenhouse damaged
> by last week's windstorm. Then back to a warm keyboard.
>
> Keith
>
> --
> Keith Lofstrom [log in to unmask]
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